|
Post by stellarboy on Jan 30, 2012 9:31:17 GMT 8
On the suspension of Matthew HartmannHere is the letter sent by the Philippine Football Federation to Loyola FC regarding the indefinite suspension of Matthew Hartmann. I agree that he should be suspended for leaving the national team but an indefinite suspension? Does the punishment fit the "crime"? Is this of Hammam-esque proportions (and to think they are not pursuing the case against the former deposed president -- who is of poor health at the moment -- who is accused of misusing funds). Now I heard from Hartmann that there is more than meets the eye in his leaving Jakarta. My beef with this is Hartmann's side was not heard. If he was asked to write a letter then was that sufficient? Was due process followed? As it is, this suspension should have been served before the start of the league so Loyola should have gotten a replacement. As it is, they have to wait for the March transfer window before they can do so. Someone said that Loyola knew that Hartmann was going to be suspended and they should have gotten another player. Not exactly correct. Suspended yes. Indefinitely suspended, no. And like it is easy to get players. Again, I believe that regardless of the circumstances surrounding his leaving the national team, Hartmann should be suspended. But indefinitely? Maybe from the national team but not his club? You are cutting him from his livelihood. bleachersbrew.blogspot.com/2012/01/on-suspension-of-matthew-hartmann.html
|
|
|
Post by leoisiah on Jan 30, 2012 9:49:26 GMT 8
Now if he won't play for Azkals and won't play in UFL, where will he go now? What will he do for a living? Do some ramp modelling? Play outside the Philippines? If the PFF didn't like what he did with the NT, then banning him from NT will do, but banning him from UFL is just too much.
|
|
|
Post by Striker_Manager_and_Owner on Jan 30, 2012 11:02:46 GMT 8
The PFF is sending a strong message to ALL players - Discipline is needed and it does not discriminate skill. Meaning even if you are a star, and especially if you are a star, your actions are scrutinized and if you do not behave in a sportsmanlike manner and if you show you are a bad example to younger players by doing something that renders disciplinary action then by all means it is justified.
Matthew Hartmann abandoned the team in the middle of a prestigious competition. Looks like he is only looking out for himself and not the team. I think the suspension was made indefinite because he was captain. Didn't the french players get suspended indefinitely from the national team for their mutiny at World Cup 2010? though they didn't get suspended from their own teams - why? because half of them did not play for french clubs. Evra was captain and he started the whole thing. He got suspended from the French National Team for five matches. Why just five? Because he said, he couldn't see his future without the National team. He wanted to get back in the squad, apologized and did the right thing. He got called back 6 matches later.
Yeah, maybe his side wasn't heard and his side of the story explained to the public, but just by leaving the team justifies this. Just my two cents.
I do not believe that his will last long. I do think if he apologizes the right way and to the right people and explains himself that they will remove this suspension. Yes his side of the story hasn't been aired out, but he hasn't apologized either.
|
|
|
Post by Wiking on Jan 30, 2012 11:04:11 GMT 8
Now if he won't play for Azkals and won't play in UFL, where will he go now? What will he do for a living? Do some ramp modelling? Play outside the Philippines? If the PFF didn't like what he did with the NT, then banning him from NT will do, but banning him from UFL is just too much. His offense was with the U23 NT not the UFL so why include the UFL? Maybe it goes deeper than we know? Did he threaten a team official or referee? That is bad news if he did. So many things we don't know.
|
|
|
Post by stellarboy on Jan 30, 2012 11:24:11 GMT 8
I wanted to believe in the PFF's decisions on the suspension for Matt Hartmann, but I believe this is really an outrage. This is too much not just for him, but for his brothers Darren and Mark who will be greatly affected by this suspension, in a psychological, sociological and financial way. His family will be utterly humiliated by this and I am afraid that as the issue intensifies, Darren might not lend his commentating services, and Mark might shun playing for Loyola Sparks and the national team.
Remember this decision was made without due process.
This reminds me a lot of the Roy Keane incident in the 2002 World Cup where he quarreled Irish national team manager Mick McCarthy. The FA did not suspended him for playing for Man Utd when he abandoned the team during the tourney. Like Hartmann, he was then the team captain.
I mean you can suspend Matt from the NT but banning the player in club competition indefinitely is harsh. A 3 game ban in the UFL would have been enough.
|
|
|
Post by stellarboy on Jan 30, 2012 11:37:19 GMT 8
Let's look back on the SEA Games thread: usapangfootball.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=336&page=55
There were tweets from Rick Olivares and Ronnie Nathanielsz indicating Matt Hartmann's unbecoming behavior during the incident: @ronnathanielsz (Ronnie Nathanielsz)"We understand Matthew Hartmann won't be fielded today because the captain missed practice the past two days while brother Mark showed up."@ronnathanielsz (Ronnie Nathanielsz)"Also received a report that's disturbing if true, that the brothers girlfriends were staying in the same hotel. Rules must be followed!"@rickyolivares (Rick Olivares): "Incident in a practice match between Loyola & Green Archers (?). heard from an enraged Hans Smit that Matthew Hartmann who is not with the U23 team at the mo was playing way too aggressive and there were harsh words exchanged with some locals wanting to gang up on him. "
Does this justify his suspension? I don't know as of yet but this could be.
|
|
|
Post by jpesarza on Jan 30, 2012 12:16:13 GMT 8
This is TOO MUCH DISCIPLINE. smh
|
|
|
Post by c_d on Jan 30, 2012 12:52:50 GMT 8
Some things to ponder on:
-Why was the suspension carried out only now? -Why were Loyola team officials not even informed about it earlier? (The UFL commentators said Loyola asst. coach Vince Santos had no clue about it until the day before the match against Stallion.) -Why are they not punishing erring match officals? (Ex. Lexton Moy getting a yellow card in their first match for complaining but a player who comes from the same province as the referees did not get booked after making a scene by slamming the ball.) -As mentioned in the article, why are they not running after the previous PFF president who committed a more serious offense against local football?
Anyway, the best thing for him to do now is to apologize and appeal the suspension.
|
|
|
Post by akosiabab on Jan 30, 2012 13:13:06 GMT 8
dapat lang. NT captain cya malaki ang gastos ng govt natin para sa seagames tapos binaliwala nya. cnu ba cya?feeling?NT captain pa naman cya cya din dahilan na low moral ang team nya. may topak ata. i remember last year championship game airforce vs meralco sinigawan nya si chieffy on the field tapos ang team ng airforce nasa likod nya kung natuloy yun kawawa cya. i mean kahit kaunting respeto mn lng wla si martmann
|
|
|
Post by Wiking on Jan 30, 2012 14:00:37 GMT 8
There is someone else, supposedly suspended by the PFF. Thats all I know at this time.
Its actually Weiss for bad coaching. Just kidding. I'll try to see who the 2nd suspendee is or if true at all...
|
|
|
Post by Striker_Manager_and_Owner on Jan 30, 2012 14:02:51 GMT 8
Roy Keane is Irish, Manchester United is an English Club. They don't have the same FA. I do not entirely agree with the PFF but maybe Weiss had a talk with them, and I'm sure his inputs were considered. If they thought that this experience would make him a better player then its up to Matt to try and become a better footballer by being a team player.
He's just like the rest of the Meralco/Loyola guys, when something bad happens they just get frustrated and dont get back on defense. They whine about almost everything. Time to grow up.
|
|
|
Post by melbmike on Jan 30, 2012 14:34:47 GMT 8
The PFF is sending a strong message to ALL players - Discipline is needed and it does not discriminate skill. Meaning even if you are a star, and especially if you are a star, your actions are scrutinized and if you do not behave in a sportsmanlike manner and if you show you are a bad example to younger players by doing something that renders disciplinary action then by all means it is justified. Matthew Hartmann abandoned the team in the middle of a prestigious competition. Looks like he is only looking out for himself and not the team. I think the suspension was made indefinite because he was captain. Didn't the french players get suspended indefinitely from the national team for their mutiny at World Cup 2010? though they didn't get suspended from their own teams - why? because half of them did not play for french clubs. Evra was captain and he started the whole thing. He got suspended from the French National Team for five matches. Why just five? Because he said, he couldn't see his future without the National team. He wanted to get back in the squad, apologized and did the right thing. He got called back 6 matches later. Yeah, maybe his side wasn't heard and his side of the story explained to the public, but just by leaving the team justifies this. Just my two cents. I do not believe that his will last long. I do think if he apologizes the right way and to the right people and explains himself that they will remove this suspension. Yes his side of the story hasn't been aired out, but he hasn't apologized either. Bolded is what is relevant. Once he files his appeal they will drop the UFL ban (no insider info just have a feeling). I think its good they did this. No one is above the team. They need to let everyone know. Doesn't matter if you are a local guy or a halfie who is playing locally, if you think you are above the team you will be shown the door. Good move IMO.
|
|
|
Post by Caz on Jan 30, 2012 15:12:14 GMT 8
I too think this is a good shakeup to bring some of the primadonna attitude bearing players back down to Earth. While the punishment fitting the crime is up for argument, I doubt there are many who would disagree on the unwritten message being relayed.
|
|
|
Post by 07lost on Jan 30, 2012 15:50:07 GMT 8
same as my comment in the orig article in bleachersbrew... pede pa din siyang mag-football, overseas nga lang... i haven't read any specific fff memo regarding the the south africa debacle but Nicholas Anelka, Patrice Evra, Thierry Henry are not playing in an fff-sanctioned tourney, they are playing in england and usa, nor keane playing in a club under the football governing body of his country, so magkaiba sitwasyon nila .... he really needs to apologize and explain himself... it was just very, well for the lack of a better word, unprofessional...
|
|
|
Post by Wiking on Jan 30, 2012 19:15:59 GMT 8
Former U-23 Azkal captain Matt Hartmann suspended indefinitely — PFFJanuary 30, 2012 2:40pm Former Under-23 Philippine Men's National Football team captain Matthew Hartmann has been declared ineligible to join any incarnation of the Philippine team and has received a ban preventing him from being fielded by local clubs or organizations for an indefinite period of time, according to the Philippine Football Federation. Hartmann was recently sent a letter by the PFF, informing him of the decision of the PFF Disciplinary Committee, based on a December 12, 2011 complaint filed against him. The 22-year-old English-Filipino infamously left in the middle of the U-23 Azkals' Southeast Asia Games campaign last November in Jakarta, due to friction with head coach Hans Michael Weiss. Prior to his departure, the Azkals dropped two matches, with Hartmann scoring an own goal in their opener against Vietnam. After his return from Jakarta, Hartmann then got into a verbal confrontation during a tune-up with members of the De La Salle University men's varsity football team and their head coach Hans Smit. Hartmann then signed with the UFL team Loyola Meralco Sparks for the 2012 season of the United Football League, but his suspension now leaves the club a man down. It is not immediately known if Hartmann plans to appeal the suspension. - Adrian Dy/KBK, GMA www.gmanetwork.com/news/story/246225/sports/football/former-u-23-azkal-captain-matt-hartmann-suspended-indefinitely-mdash-pff?ref=subsection_item
I'm the last one to forgive Matt for his actions at SEAG, so punish him with a ban against him joining a National Team. I dunno what happened with the verbal "confrontation" with DLSU but a lifetime ban is a bit harsh isn't it. Unless this guy threatened to kill everyone in the other team, but lifetime? I think he's being used as an example. Unlucky him.
|
|