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Post by cjeagle on Mar 3, 2012 9:51:41 GMT 8
Nobody is saying that she doesn't have a legitimate complaint. None of us would like our mothers, sisters and daughters treated disrespectfully. It is the way she handled the matter that is being questioned. Instead of addressing the issue with the appropriate parties and officials, she went straight to the media and the AFC. We have a reputation in Asia especially in political circles of being scandal ridden as it is and this doesn't help matters. Instead of just thinking of her wounded pride, a daughter of a former Philippine president should also be thinking of the shame and dishonor this will bring to our country in the eyes of our neighbors. She can still address this locally without airing our dirty laundry abroad.
In regards to the issue of Guirado being half dressed, I would have to say that this is a common aspect of sports culture abroad. Here in the US, journalists have a right which they fought for, to interview players after the game and they (including female journalists) frequently do this in front of half naked athletes who might be in their underwear or even towels. I think the issue in this case is a difference in cultural values and norms and our European player's sensibilities not being in sync with the more prudish value of some of our womenfolk.
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Post by cypher210 on Mar 3, 2012 9:57:44 GMT 8
i understand the complain about moy but i dont understand why she complained about angel. shes in the locker room. does that mean everyone has to be dressed and covered up before she comes in? its a guys locker room. people would be taking showers and walk around naked before and after the game. why did she walk in there when she knows people would be half naked.
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Post by fadzki on Mar 3, 2012 10:04:29 GMT 8
I think Cristy Ramos went about this the wrong way. Her concerns might be legitimate but she should have brought this up first with Dan Palami and the PFF and elicited an apology from the players. Instead she went straight to the media and the AFC. As the daughter of a former President, she should have known that by bringing this up to the AFC, she has brought shame and dishonor to the Philippine team and by inference to the Philippine nation as a whole. Basically, this is like hanging the family's dirty laundry out in public. This will probably affect the player's state of mind when the games start next week. I agree with this one... why go directly to the AFC while she could have talk with Palami who she meet after the game and she didn't even bother to tell Palami about the said harassment... the Challenge Cup has not even started and PHL are already in a lot of trouble...
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Post by shakoy on Mar 3, 2012 10:07:47 GMT 8
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Post by rogue on Mar 3, 2012 11:22:45 GMT 8
i understand the complain about moy but i dont understand why she complained about angel. shes in the locker room. does that mean everyone has to be dressed and covered up before she comes in? its a guys locker room. people would be taking showers and walk around naked before and after the game. why did she walk in there when she knows people would be half naked. Kailangan ba talaga sa locker room ang inspection? Hindi ba pwede sa labas pagkatapos nilang mag-prepare? With regards to Angel, she could have exerted her authority there by asking Angel to put on shorts or towel because they were doing a formal inspection & called him again when he was "properly clothed" for the inspection. Or when she went inside the locker room and saw that the team was not yet prepared she could have said to them to get their bearings as they were going to do their inspection for a few minutes and that the guys could go back to what they were doing shortly. I'm not disregarding the offensive behavior but since she has done this numerous times already, she could have handled that situation differently. I'm never a fan of people going straight to media particularly here in the Philippines kase it tends to be a trial by publicity. If you have a serious case, go straight to the right channel, follow the line of authority.
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Post by azkalvolcanogilas on Mar 3, 2012 11:24:53 GMT 8
Nobody is saying that she doesn't have a legitimate complaint. None of us would like our mothers, sisters and daughters treated disrespectfully. It is the way she handled the matter that is being questioned. Instead of addressing the issue with the appropriate parties and officials, she went straight to the media and the AFC. We have a reputation in Asia especially in political circles of being scandal ridden as it is and this doesn't help matters. Instead of just thinking of her wounded pride, a daughter of a former Philippine president should also be thinking of the shame and dishonor this will bring to our country in the eyes of our neighbors. She can still address this locally without airing our dirty laundry abroad. In regards to the issue of Guirado being half dressed, I would have to say that this is a common aspect of sports culture abroad. Here in the US, journalists have a right which they fought for, to interview players after the game and they (including female journalists) frequently do this in front of half naked athletes who might be in their underwear or even towels. I think the issue in this case is a difference in cultural values and norms and our European player's sensibilities not being in sync with the more prudish value of some of our womenfolk. Never that I said that you said Ms Ramos got no legitimate complaint, it is obvious she got legitimate complaint. My motive is to straighten out the wrong attitude towards the scenario. It is ironic that you mentioned about the women we love in our lives because yet still you insist minimum exposure to the case. Mod, the real value for Philippine sports is responsible values and not winning. Hiding something like that will just be in the long run detrimental to the campaign. Someone has to learn to the utmost, being in a high profile role in Philippine sports. In all walks of life, your chosen career has its corresponding benefits and consequences. While you enjoy the benefits, you also have to face the risk of having it. Guirado and Moy are part of the passionately-followed Azkal team that is obviously public entity. Therefore, you cannot retract the consequence that they are also exposed to public scrutiny and judgment. Another thing, it is very easy for us to criticize Ms. Ramos of her act like going to the media straight away or she should have not done this or she should have done this....but the point is we were never there, we could not feel what she felt, we do not know the gravity of the situation why she has to act such way. These are the things to ponder before we let our passion rule over us. I am in all Azkal live games, followed them and defended them quite well. The only part of the Azkals that I criticized is Michael Weiss and never the players. I also was so pissed off when there were wrong allegations on Anton del Rosario, Rob Gier etc., about sexual harassment. By the way, Christy Ramos is part of the FIFA committee and the protocol is through the AFC and not to PFF or directly to Palami. She did not go to the media, only that the media picked it up and sensationalized it. In fact, media reports already included response from Palami, therefore before the media got the story, Palami and company already know the complaint. Just to clear, I still regard Moy and Guirado innocent until proven guilty. Anyway, I rest my case. I am just disturbed that passionate following rules over rational reasoning.
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Post by Striker_Manager_and_Owner on Mar 3, 2012 11:37:44 GMT 8
First of all may i say that she put herself in this situation:
A locker room is what it is, a room full of highly charged, testosterone filled men who are getting dressed/preparing for a match. I mean, if you went in a locker room, YOU SHOULD EXPECT to see half naked and naked men! Come on! We're all adults here. Do the inspection before they go into the locker room or after they are dressed!
Moy's comments however do tread the thin line between a bad remark and a remark that you can classify as sexually abusive. But internal discussions should happen before you file a complaint like this! Go through the process and the authorities should do their jobs.
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Post by spam on Mar 3, 2012 12:54:15 GMT 8
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Post by gapobanana on Mar 3, 2012 13:10:35 GMT 8
hay nako...feeling ko pati sa aff suzuki cup may iskandalo ulit...lagi nlng...let's just pray na magiging aus na ang lahat
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Post by shanks608 on Mar 3, 2012 13:13:41 GMT 8
I think it would be better if we would hear both sides first before judging. We don't know what was the situation when Lexton Moy allegedly said “Must be a B cup,”. He could have been referring to a teammate or somebody else. We all know that a lot of horsing around happen in locker rooms.
Or in Angel's side, it could've been just normal for him to stand around wearing only his underwear since he was still in the locker room. It could've been just a simple misunderstanding, knowing that we filipinos are very conservative in nature. We can all just speculate...
BUT! if those allegations are proven true, then i would fully support whatever the sanctions that FIFA would give to the players. Respect for others must always be maintained and prioritized.
This problem wouldn't be this sensationalized if in the first place Ms. Ramos talked to Dan Palami and to the players involved before filing a complaint. I can't blame her though for doing this because she has every right to complain if she felt that she was being violated.
Lexton and Angel are still innocent until proven guilty.. I just hope these things won't affect their morale in the upcoming Challenge Cup games.
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Post by kelvinreambonanza on Mar 3, 2012 13:43:00 GMT 8
__T___ I__, ung anak pa ni FVR ang tinalo! Haha Idol ko talaga tong mga askals nato, maginoo pero medyo bastos. Haha
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Post by shawnjoie on Mar 3, 2012 16:15:16 GMT 8
I am a little bit skeptical about things. I know Moy is kind of a joker most of the time... Angel,being in the locker room, maybe was not prepared for the inspection... I commend Ms Ramos for fighting what she think is right and for showing that even a Female commisioner should be respected in every aspect of the game. But I also hope that this issue is not a propaganda of some sorts...We know that there are a lot of politics in Sports and I hope this is not one of them. I pray that the Team will be able to handle the pressure coming from this issue. As they said " There is Sunshine after the Rain."
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Post by chololot12 on Mar 3, 2012 21:21:20 GMT 8
wala na tayong mawa kung ma suspend ung dalawa..Medyo influential rin kasi complainant eh. Medyo conservative rin talaga tayong mga pilipino. Tapos foreign born pa ung dalawa...
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Post by stellarboy on Mar 4, 2012 1:22:46 GMT 8
GMA News report on the complaint by Commissioner Ramos:
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Post by dingodile5 on Mar 4, 2012 17:06:16 GMT 8
Philippines FA Apologizes To Lady Match Commisioner For Sexual Harassment Case; Two Charged Players Not To Be Suspended Or Imposed Penalty Before AFC Challenge Cup Mar 4, 2012 12:36:16 AM Philippines FA and National team manager, Dan Palami had issued a public apology on behalf of the Azkals while the PFF ethics committee headed by lawyer Eric Ingles is making a parallel investigation to determine sanctions for sexual harrassment case. Cristy Ramos, who served as match commissioner of the international football friendly pitting the Philippines and Malaysia on Wednesday, has filed a sexual harassment complaint before the Asian Football Confederation against the players. Ramos, the daughter of former President Fidel V. Ramos who served as president of the Philippine Olympic Committee from 1997 to 1999, said she felt disrespected when she conducted the prematch inspection inside the Azkals’ dugout at the Rizal Memorial Stadium. Palami said that the incident could be traced to pure misunderstanding. He reasoned out that Guirado was doing his usual pre-game exercise routine and Moy was discussing something when Ramos entered the dugout. In her complaint to AFC disciplinary committee chairman Lim Kia Tong, Ramos complained about the behavior of Moy and Angel Guirado and the Philippine team during the routine pre-match team check. Team manager Dan Palami and coach Michael Weiss were not present. No suspension on the players before AFC Challenge Cup: Though Ramos filed a complaint with the Asian Football Confederation (AFC), match commissioner Christy Ramos said she doesn’t expect it will lead to any suspension or penalty before next week’s Challenge Cup in Nepal. “Of course they have to evaluate the merits of my complaint. They will have to investigate both sides. Investigation will take time,” Ramos told Sun.Star Cebu. The Philippine team is now in Nepal and is busy acclimatizing for their Challenge Cup matches against defending champions North Korea, and former champions India and Tajikistan. www.goalnepal.com/news.php?id=6827
Guirado and Moy will not be suspended. Buti naman
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