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Post by xyz1000 on Jul 7, 2011 21:21:43 GMT 8
saw this video form Youtube (quality not that good though)... Manny Otts great run. That was a nice, nice run! Good show of ball dribbling, goes through two defenders as he accelerates, and makes a great pass. Looks like JY who missed, but it was close. Thanks for sharing that.
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Post by xyz1000 on Jul 8, 2011 9:33:40 GMT 8
Thank you, Raul. Watching it now!
Up to the Chieffy's goal in the 19th minute, some comments: 1. No selfish possession by Chieffy. I'll have to watch the whole game to make it more definitive. 2. Sri Lanka can barely string together three passes. 3. Guirado could've passed to someone else during a mistake clearance. Not a bad idea to shoot -- it was on goal, but passing to Phil or Chieffy (I didn't see who it was) might've been a higher probability for a goal. 4. Commentator Hartmann is still good even in this second viewing. He's one to keep. 5. Chieffy's goal was with four Sri Lanka players in front. "Selfish" possession and shooting led to the goal! 6. Great give-and-go run by Schrock. If the Sri Lanka defense didn't tip it ever so slightly, the through ball from James to Schrock would've led to a goal that would've been even more beautiful than Guirado's.
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Post by xyz1000 on Jul 10, 2011 23:29:45 GMT 8
27:26 Mulder - Chieffy exchange while Mulders off balance. Great pass. Then Chieffy to Guirado for attack, onside, bad cross.
28:08 Throw in Mulder to center -- PY for shot, not on goal. Great Mulders pass.
29:00 Chieffy to PY, but foul
29:35 Schrock to JY to Guirado who shoots, parried away by GK. Guirado could've passed to PY whow as open.
30:43 Ott steals, pass to Phil, to Chieffy, to Ott, then cleared by defense
31:00 Cross by Guirado to JY in center but saved by GK
31:44 Smooth move by Mulders to evade Sri Lanka. Makes it look easy.
32:14 Gier slightly beaten on right side, then tackles ball away. Good way to reedeem himself.
33:20 Anton beaten on right side, pulls player down just outside the box. Dangerous but foul on purpose. Yellow card. Free kick.
35:00 Aly kicks out ball from center, out for corner kick Sri Lanka. Comes to nothing.
36:02 Schrock trips player, gets yellow. Looks like minimal contact, could even argue diving by Sri Lanka. This is where his temper flares.
38:50 Chieffy corner, great header by Aly but good save.
41:00 Schrock, falling down goes in direction of ball to disrupt passing. Can see the defensive experience there.
41:25 Anton moves up, crosses but terrible -- no one there.
42:35 Sri Lanka back pass mistake bounces to PY, who brings it up to goal!
45+ JY weak cross half effort by Ott (?) to collect unsuccessful, ball goes to Chieffy, who tries to get a shot on goal. No one to pass to.
45+ Exchange/passing between Chieffy, PY, and Mulders finds ball in cross to center but no one there to finish.
That's it for first half. Based on this there's no sign of so-called "ballhog" by Chieffy. If anything, Guirado is the one who could've passed more but this is subjective, because you want a forward to shoot! If you're a forward, it's always, always better to shoot when there's a slight openning and to pass only when it's an easy pass and the person you're passing to will have an almost guaranteed shot on goal. This is not basketball, folks. Giving that extra pass is just another chance for the defense to clear it away.
Mulders quiet, but the impact is there. Shows the vision that a holding midfielder must have.
Second half later....
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Post by cowscrubber on Jul 11, 2011 0:23:27 GMT 8
41:00 Schrock, falling down goes in direction of ball to disrupt passing. Can see the defensive experience there. I was amused by that move, too! ;D And I agree with you on the passing. Finding an "open" teammate is not reason enough for passing, unlike perhaps in basketball. Pretty basic stuff that some new football fans may not know.
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Post by bluefeather80 on Jul 11, 2011 0:24:25 GMT 8
alam namin yan. kaya si guirado at phil pwede. pero si chippy hindi kasi di naman siya forward. you yourself said it was a selfish play by chippy that led to the goal and buti pumasok if not uulitin niya pa yung ganung selfish play.kaya nga nasabi ng mga katabi ko dun sa rizal di nagballhog kasi nakaquota na. just look at ian di tumigil sa kaka selfish play kasi di pa naka quota.
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Post by xyz1000 on Jul 11, 2011 1:31:45 GMT 8
alam namin yan. kaya si guirado at phil pwede. pero si chippy hindi kasi di naman siya forward. you yourself said it was a selfish play by chippy that led to the goal and buti pumasok if not uulitin niya pa yung ganung selfish play.kaya nga nasabi ng mga katabi ko dun sa rizal di nagballhog kasi nakaquota na. just look at ian di tumigil sa kaka selfish play kasi di pa naka quota. You took my comments out of context. I was praising Chieffy for that selfish play -- he is in the box, no one to pass to unless he does a backpass, which is something you don't do when you're in the box, and so he takes that shot! It was the right thing to do, hit or miss. In that situation, being unselfish and passing it back would be a huge mistake, an opportunity lost.
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Post by beho on Jul 11, 2011 4:16:49 GMT 8
alam namin yan. kaya si guirado at phil pwede. pero si chippy hindi kasi di naman siya forward. you yourself said it was a selfish play by chippy that led to the goal and buti pumasok if not uulitin niya pa yung ganung selfish play.kaya nga nasabi ng mga katabi ko dun sa rizal di nagballhog kasi nakaquota na. just look at ian di tumigil sa kaka selfish play kasi di pa naka quota. ;Dnope not that time miss.....i agree with you medjo buwakaw at over-dribbling si chieffy minsan..... pero not that time, tama yung decision nyang mg-attempt ng goal that time, kahit na mg-miss yun good try yon .... ;D
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Post by vimjonk on Jul 11, 2011 9:18:46 GMT 8
... You took my comments out of context. I was praising Chieffy for that selfish play -- he is in the box, no one to pass to unless he does a backpass, which is something you don't do when you're in the box, and so he takes that shot! It was the right thing to do, hit or miss. In that situation, being unselfish and passing it back would be a huge mistake, an opportunity lost. Take a look at the video "closer" once again. There are teammates to his right on that play ;D
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Post by xyz1000 on Jul 11, 2011 10:43:19 GMT 8
45:45 Sri Lanka attack on left, Chieffy unnecessary sliding kick to intercept, ball bounces to box -- bad play! Can't see but either Mulders or someone (PHL) else was there, so completely unnecessary sliding kick. Embarrassing, really.
46:30 Excellent attack that starts from the back. Mulders to Schrock to PY to Schrock give-and-go to PY, who crosses to center.... badly! Anything close to Guirado, who was poorly marked, and it wouldn've been a goal!
47:40 Chieffy corner, one of his better ones, low in the air and nicely aimed at center, Guirado heads it but right to a defender. S.L. starts their counter attack...
47:57 ...which makes it all the way up and then kicked to the side by Anton. Nice sliding move.
49:12 from back, Guirado to Chieffy, lob to PY but offside.
50:00 Free kick S.L. makes it to center, but Gier heads to clear, Azkals start another attack. Guirado collects, back pass to JY, and then through ball to Guirado, runs it up for Goal!
51:38 Attack starts from Ott from back, to Anton at right, long pass to JY who is clear, runs up fast, crosses.... badly! Kicked away by S.L.
51:56 Mulders intercepts well above in S.L. side, and is quickly dispossessed. Bad move, could've done better if he hustled.
52:55 Anton in defense at right, and S.L. player falls to ground as if pushed hard. Didn't look like it, only minimal contact. S.L. player probably fishing for that 2nd yellow for Anton. Ref doesn't buy it, but free kick given.
53:30 Free kick easily cleared by Mulders, to Ott, to Guirado, to PY.... offside.
54:30 Aly kicks out on left side. Throw-in Sri Lanka, finds its way to Chieffy deep on left, and makes excellet clear past half line. Chieffy is unusually deep in defense on that one...
54:55 ...perhaps because with 3 goals can do more defense now. S.L. dispossessed, Chieffy nice through ball to Guirado who starts to accelerate up, beating two playlers, but cross attempt is blocked, corner kick...
55:40 Corner kick is passed short to Schrock who dribbles to box against two S.L., goes down... leads to penalty shot. That was just so bad by S.L.... don't know what he was thinking. We all know what happens next... TV cuts to show Angel Locsin celebrating.
57:52 S.L. attack, Gier heads clear to Mulders (? or PY?)on left who collects and passes to center, a bad decision because 3 S.L. players quickly go to Ott (?), who finally passes to Gier who safely clears. Bad defensive sequence.
50:30 sub by S.L.
59:00 Deep in left, almost the corner, Chieffy dispossesses S.L. player. Nice, but what is he doing so deep? S.L. foul, leads to free kick...
60:00 ? Broadcast loses/doesn't show clock. Neil takes long free kick, Guirado heads to ground, to S.L., kicks it up to mid field, Ott collects, dribbles up to JY one touch, Chieffy one touch, back to Ott, who shoots! Wide to right. Nice sequence.
62:00 ? Aly clears from center, Chieffy finds it runs up, long ball to Schrock but off-target, as Schrock stlightly pushes/nudges S.L. player in attempt to get ball.
63:00 ? Guirado in corner of box dispossessed, counter starts .. which ends in bad looping pass that Neil gets. There was no one in S.L. close, probably a miskick
64:00 ? Schrock upfield, passes to JY on right who crosses badly! Could've done better if ball to Schrock was on-target. But leads to corner as S.L. heads it out.
65:00 Chieffy takes corner, S.L. clears nicely.
65:00 ? Anton long ball, it bounces to Guirado, to Chieffy just outside the box, and shoots weakly! Not a great look for a shot but still the right thing to do.
At this point I'm beginning to think that if Chieffy is guilty of anything, it's of being out-of-position many times. He is all over the field -- just a while back deep in defense at left, now up in front at right. Yes, the action and positioning is fluid, but I'm seeing a pattern here.
65:00 S.L. attack comes to nothing, Azkals just jogging and quickly get it back. Aly long ball to mid field to Guirado, heads it forward but no one there. S.L. attack on left.. Azkals kicks out, S.L. throw in, and Ian getting ready to come in.
66:00 ? Throw in, longkick to center, foul by S.L. in box. Ian comes in for PY. Good thing, because PY has a yellow from the previous game. I was wondering when PY would be subbed out and personally I think it's too late. Weiss should've done it sooner. Aly still hasn't collected his yellow at this point. Again, with this kind of lead it would've been good to sub Aly out.
66:00 ? Neil goal kick past midfield, S.L. gets, then in chase to ball in midfield between S.L. player, Schrock, and Aly, Aly slides towards the ball... given a yellow. Succeeding free kick goes for ... goal kick, what what was S.L. doing?
67:00 ? Nice sequence of keep-away by Azkals, Ott, PY, etc. Ott to Chieffy, gets closer to goal, and shoots. A pass to Mulders on left would've been better, although that's still arguable. If this is the "ballhog" play being referred to, well that's one so far. He may not have seen Mulders on his left since he was looking to the front, but still that's his fault for not having the vision. The shot was on goal, and strong, and had to be a good play by GK. If that rebounded, which often happens to a strong shot like that, a guaranteed goal because Schrock or Aly (?) was the only one close to the GK.
68:00 ? Neil goal kick 50/50 leads to foul, so Schrock free kick to center, Guirado heads but bad. S.L. starts to move up.
69:00 ? Schrock and Guirado dispossess S.L., nice, pass back to JY to Schrock, accelerates (he is fast! also, Guirado is down), and fantastic through ball to 18 yrd box picture perfect to Chieffy, who is running alongside Ian?, Chieffy is brought down, then Ian gets ball tries to shoot, weak, collected by GK. Should've been a penalty. Chieffy down, probably wanting that penalty. Hartmann (announcer) says that if Ian stopped running then Chieffy might've gotten the penalty because of advantage that Ian was there, but I disagree there. Whether or not Ian was there Chieffy could've had a shot on goal if he wasn't brought down. I think bad ref call.
Clock is finally shown.
70:00 Chieffy still down, stretchered out.
70:57 Neil goal kick to Ian, offside as he still tries to shoot.
72:07 I think that's Aly (maybe Mulders?) who gets ball as S.L. attack, long ball to Ian on left, onside, runs fast to attack close to box with three S.L. on him. JY is free running up, but there's no way Ian can make that pass unless it's not Ian but actually Messi. And the shot is actually pretty good. GK parries out, corner...
72:50 Schrock takes corner, to Guirado, loops up and out. Wish they would show replay on that. Wondering if Guirado could've done better.
72:40 Ott chases S.L. attack on right, and player goes down, Ott complaining that it wasn't much contact. He's right. S.L. makes a sub.
74:20 Free kick, nicely headed out, to Ian who starts accelerating up, dispossessed. Can't pass to Chieffy because he's offside. If Ian one-touched that one to Chieffy, then it would've been onside and a runaway by Chieffy. That's probably asking too much of Ian.
74:36 S.L. attack makes it to the box, but a weak shot and Neil collects easily.
74:50 Schrock to Ian to Chieffy, a little mishandling, to JY, has to backpass to reset attack, to Schrock, tries to loop to running Guirado but missed.
75:10 S.L. attack, tries through ball by fails, get it back, makes it to box but plenty of Azkals there, manages a shot, weak, Neil collects.
76:11 Gener comes in for Chieffy.
77:50 Mulders, now playing midfield, pass up to JY?, then Schrock, moving up, he missed what would've been an excellent through ball to JY who was running up with no mark on him.
78:55 Gener and Guirado exchange to move up, foul by Guirado, slight leg contact.
79:40 JY brought down, could've easily been a yellow. He gets up quickly.
79:50 Schrock in midfield mistimes run by Anton on right.
81:02 JY in long ball, nice, finds Ian one-on-one with defender, runs up, shoots, but wide. No Azkals was close.
81:30 2-on-2 attack, Ian and James on right. Ian shoots. It's hard to see in the camera angle whether the lane to a cross to JY was clear, but JY is visibly upset that he didn't get the ball. I think a cross would've been better a better decision, but it's still not a bad play. The chance for a goal might've been just as good. If this is the play where "ballhog" is labeled, it's a weak arguement. Ian hits that ball right and it's a goal. A cross would have to be perfect to hit JY.
82:25 Goal kick by Neil to mid-field, Guirado gets elbowed in back of head but stays up. Finds the ball, moves up, give-and-go with Ian? and he is onside, goes down in box, no foul.
83:04 Mulders finds JY, but he can't handle pass, maybe he's just tired because he should've. Heads out. Nice pass by Mulders, can't fault him on that.
83:54 There's that great run by Ott on the left. Beautiful and he weaves through two defenders, passes to JY... who misses.
84:32 Another Azkal attack, Schrock to JY just outside box, can't collect. At this time JY really looks tired. He should be subbed out. He has got to be in better shape than this, I hate to say.
85:17 Azkals moving ball in back, pin-point passes of keep away.
85:40 Ian gets ball, attacks but he's by himself.
86:38 JY deep, crosses to center, finds Gener but is well marked. Cleared out.
86:42 Mulders long ball to center, but no one there to run. Again, except for Ian looks like players are tired.
88:00 Azkals playing keep away
88:05 2nd yellow, now red for S.L. #4. Uses hands to deflect ball.
89:00 free kick just at top of box, blocked by wall.
89:40 S.L. attack, makes it to box, kicks it to Anton's arm. No call. Could've been a 2nd yellow for Anton and a penalty kick. Ref didn't see.
90+ JY through ball to Guirado but either mistime or tired.
91:14, S.L. back pass mistake to Ian, lob to Guirado who runs up quickly, only GK to beat, he does, but weak left kick to OPEN GOAL is chased by defender. He's tired. Or he just can't kick with left.
==== Disagree that there were glaring "ballhog" plays in the game. Chieffy definitely not. Even Ian it's difficult to argue and I would have to disagree with Coach W. if he thinks so. Remember that Ian was a sub, and one important job of the sub who's a forward is to run fast, and challenge the speed of the already tired defenders. So move up running and start shooting.
Schrock made some good plays, but he also had some poor ones. The good ones were very good and that's probably why not much attention was made on the bad ones. JY and Guirado need to be in better condition. Could see them visibly tired, but it was also because they, JY especially, were working very hard thoughout the game.
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Post by xyz1000 on Jul 11, 2011 10:49:03 GMT 8
... You took my comments out of context. I was praising Chieffy for that selfish play -- he is in the box, no one to pass to unless he does a backpass, which is something you don't do when you're in the box, and so he takes that shot! It was the right thing to do, hit or miss. In that situation, being unselfish and passing it back would be a huge mistake, an opportunity lost. Take a look at the video "closer" once again. There are teammates to his right on that play ;D Indeed, there was a player on his right (can't identify), but he was moving away from goal (don't know why, to get separation perhaps), and other PHL players were behind.
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Post by bluefeather80 on Jul 11, 2011 11:34:16 GMT 8
chippy's not clear ballhog was because naka quota na siya. had he not a scored a goal yet sigiradong maraming ballhog plays pa mangyayari.
pero to say ian's clear and sunod2x ballhog play are difficult to say as ballhog plays wala na to.rofl may pa minute by minute play by play analysis ka pa. para magmukha kang expert dito lols. you may disagree with us here pero to say you disagree with coach weiss, that's sheer arrogance.he know's what he's doing.unlike us,trabaho niya yan. he means what he said that there are ballhog players because he was up close and personal to see it.
tapos instead of praising the hardworking jyh and guirado gusto niya pang better condition? lols what do you want from these two guys? they are already hardworking. dun ka humingi ng better condition sa mga tamad na ang intensyon lang ay mag goal kahit walang chance at walang naitutulong sa depensa. you point out pati si shrock because there were some bad plays.but they were overshadowed because he was able to compensate it with many good plays. while yung sa mga ballhogs ayaw mong i point out kahit wala silang maicompensate na maganda sa mga mali nila. baliktad ata utak nito, kung sino yung mga masipag magaling at adheres to teamwork eh sila pa binabatikos nito.nakita niya pa small details ng hardworking jyh guirado at ke shrock pero yung glaring ballhog plays ni ian i'll have to disagree with coach weiss daw amf. rofl lmao
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Post by bluefeather80 on Jul 11, 2011 11:50:21 GMT 8
alam namin yan. kaya si guirado at phil pwede. pero si chippy hindi kasi di naman siya forward. you yourself said it was a selfish play by chippy that led to the goal and buti pumasok if not uulitin niya pa yung ganung selfish play.kaya nga nasabi ng mga katabi ko dun sa rizal di nagballhog kasi nakaquota na. just look at ian di tumigil sa kaka selfish play kasi di pa naka quota. ;Dnope not that time miss.....i agree with you medjo buwakaw at over-dribbling si chieffy minsan..... pero not that time, tama yung decision nyang mg-attempt ng goal that time, kahit na mg-miss yun good try yon .... ;D that selfish play from that situation did not come from me it was from another poster. kinopya ko lang siya kasi yun ang ginamit niya. just because i've been saying chippy and others have been ballhog doesn't mean na everytime they shoot they are ballhogs. on that situation he has the opportunity, maganda ang pass ni phil. if chippy passes again mawawala na ang chance gets namin yan. ang sinasabi naming ballhog are those napasahan sila then dadalhin nila ang bola to the box by themselves then wala nang makitang teammates kundi ang goal lang tapos ayun tira. basta my point to that post was buti pumasok kasi kung hindi, siguradong magpipilit yan maka goal be it from situations he has to shoot not ballhog or has to pass but chose to shoot ballhog.ksai that's what the two has been doing since mongo 1 upto present. we may not all agree on who are ballhogs or not but i know we all will certainly agree that ballhogs and their ballhog plays will certainly cost us if they do that against strong teams like kuwait. yan ang gusto namin, as early as now no more ballhogs.
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Post by beho on Jul 13, 2011 5:01:46 GMT 8
;Dnope not that time miss.....i agree with you medjo buwakaw at over-dribbling si chieffy minsan..... pero not that time, tama yung decision nyang mg-attempt ng goal that time, kahit na mg-miss yun good try yon .... ;D that selfish play from that situation did not come from me it was from another poster. kinopya ko lang siya kasi yun ang ginamit niya. just because i've been saying chippy and others have been ballhog doesn't mean na everytime they shoot they are ballhogs. on that situation he has the opportunity, maganda ang pass ni phil. if chippy passes again mawawala na ang chance gets namin yan. ang sinasabi naming ballhog are those napasahan sila then dadalhin nila ang bola to the box by themselves then wala nang makitang teammates kundi ang goal lang tapos ayun tira. basta my point to that post was buti pumasok kasi kung hindi, siguradong magpipilit yan maka goal be it from situations he has to shoot not ballhog or has to pass but chose to shoot ballhog.ksai that's what the two has been doing since mongo 1 upto present. we may not all agree on who are ballhogs or not but i know we all will certainly agree that ballhogs and their ballhog plays will certainly cost us if they do that against strong teams like kuwait. yan ang gusto namin, as early as now no more ballhogs. ;Dok as you said let's just leave it to coach weiss about this matter... at least, aware naman siya rito at i think kaya niya ihandle ito...... ;D
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